Part 3
I start musing as to what else I can add to the Ascot, as
if it's not perfect already! Steve's as patient as ever in his replies.
Some of the ideas bear fruit, others are rejected.
Ohlins
Rear Shock
A-Tue 27-02-2001 23:57
Your advice, please.
S-Wed 28-02-2001 0:17
Brian said you would be
better off
with an Ohlins rear shock!!!!
What
a suggestion! I'd overlooked this item in the original specification. Having
looked at the Ohlins website, I decided it is a "must have" for a
bike like the Ascot TT.
Ohlins Advanced Suspension Technology
A-Wed 28-02-2001 9:55
Would this be the one?
Öhlins
shock absorber
|
Part
No.
|
|
Type
|
|
Position
|
|
|
TR
504
|
|
46ERS
|
|
Rear
|
|
•
Emulsion-type shock absorber with rebound adjuster.
• Fits bikes where there is no room for an external
reservoir.
• Hose mounted adjuster knob, easy to fit where it is easy
to reach.
• 12 mm adjustment range to compensate for extra luggage
and/or a passenger.
How much? If it's reasonable, I'll go for it for the Ascot. (One
thing I would always liked to have been able to do with the T-bird is
adjust the rear shock.)
S-Thu 01-03-2001 18:26
That is the one, we have fitted it on our one and the difference is
really very noticeable, much better.
The price is 326.00uk ex tax.
A-Fri 02-03-2001 0:32
OK for the Ohlins - good price.
Shocked?!!! Seriously, I'm looking forward to this bike very much and
want it to be something special, like no one else has, so if Brian has
anymore sensible suggestions, I'm open.
S-Fri 02-03-2001 1:02
Thank you for that.
I just hope that we can get the shock now. It seems that we have beaten Ohlins stocking for T-Bird dampers, they are having to
open up another production line to build extras for us. I think Brian said we have 8 on order at the minute.
Fly
Screen
A-Sat 03-03-2001 2:16
Just been looking through the Triumph accessory pages:
Triumph
Motorcycles - Accessories
Would the Legend fly screen go with the Ascot, in yours and Brian's
valuable opinions. If yes, could you match the paint - perhaps get the
black one, leave the inside black and use the Ascot silver on the front
side....
S-Sat 03-03-2001 17:38
NO!! The actual expression was it would look "pants".
A-Sat 03-03-2001 23:54
OK, enough silly ideas... You see how much I'm looking forward to
this and to an extent it's frustrating only having photos on which to
make judgements as to what would look good / special etc. I'll leave any
other suggestions to you and your experts.
A-Fri 30-03-2001 8:20
You were right about the Triumph TBS fly screen, but this one
from National Cycle may just be OK for keeping the flies and mosquitoes at
bay ..... thoughts?
National Cycle Flyscreen
Black
Wheels
S-Thu 01-03-2001 18:26
The only other thing we have under way at the moment is getting some
wheels made. Black rims and hubs with stainless spokes. When we
get them fitted to our bike I will take a few pictures for you.
A-Fri 02-03-2001 0:32
Not sure about the wheels. I'll await the photos.
S-Sun 04-03-2001 1:17
We should have some different wheels soon, black alloy rims with
black
hubs and stainless spokes. I'll send you a picture when they are fitted
and any upgrades that we do to our bike.
A-Fri 06-04-2001 21:23
You mentioned a while ago about sending some pictures of some black
wheels with stainless spokes for your Ascot. Did they ever materialise?
S-Fri 06-04-2001 22:12
We are still waiting for them, but we hope that it will be soon. I'm
really keen to see what they turn out like.
A-Tue 10-04-2001 20:34
You probably saw in my web pages, the picture of an Ascot in some bike show
with all black forks. Did you ever think of going that all black? Was that
where you got idea for the black rim wheels from? Personally, I think it's a
bit too black, unless you want to go for the old Speed Triple totally black
look that is.
S-Tue 10-04-2001 23:34
Franck
made one with black wheels and it looks rather nice, so being us
we took it a stage on and are trying black hubs with stainless spokes
and black rims.
S-Thu 24-05-2001 23:44
Joe
has about finished mine, but we are
stuck for the MT60's. Pirelli have no stock and my
supplier is trying everywhere for a rear one.
Still
it is running and I think he will be
putting some miles on it tonight. I'm going to use the black
wheels and will send you a picture when they are fitted.
A-Sat 26-05-2001 10:32
Talking of pictures, any chance of some detailed ones of the
Ascot in your shop. If you could indulge me with one of your shop taken from
the outside, that would be good for the site.
Have
you thought about trying the Pirelli Dragons on the Ascot? They seem to get
good reviews. I know they don't have quite the same rugged look. Heard on the
Tiger list that the Metzler Tourrance are also in short supply.
Be
good to hear in detail about his experience with the FCRs - response, any
fickle problems etc. What jets are you using? Have you got the 3:3 s?
Look
forward to the pictures of the black wheels.
S-Wed 30-05-2001 1:13
I
must take a picture of the Inca Gold bike for you.
A-Sat
23/06/2001 11:37
Still
looking forward to getting your picture of the Inca Gold Ascot with the black
wheels??
S-Mon
25/06/2001 19:52
Promise I'll do it soon!!
A-Mon
23/07/2001 18:29
Talking of which, pictures of the gold Ascot with black wheels??????
S-Mon
03/09/2001 21:42
I have attached some
pictures of the Gold one, at last. I managed to get a couple of minutes
away from the counter, we have been very busy.
Air
Filters
A-Sat 03-03-2001 23:54
I did find the French site that designed the Ascot kits. Noticed that
some of them are displayed with K&N filters without any covers.
Personally, I think the black air filter cover on yours looks nicer. Do
you have K&Ns underneath or not? Did you quote for me on the Flat
Slides include K&Ns or which?
X-Company Mecatwin
S-Sun 04-03-2001 1:17
The flat slides do lose the covers at the moment, we are trying
to work on a solution by using the ram air tubes supplied with the
kit and putting them inside the original air box. I don't know if
it will work yet, but we will be trying over the next week or so.
I had quoted you for the full kit which included
the K&N filters.
A-Tue 06-03-2001 17:53
It's hard to tell without seeing for real, but from the photographs
the black covers you have over the air filter on your Ascot look very
nice, better IMO than the bare K&N filters. Hope you can come up
with a solution that keeps a similar look for my bike.
A-Fri 30-03-2001 1:17
What was your solution to hiding the K&N filters behind the
covers?
S-Fri 30-03-2001 21:24
Joe is trying to have a look at this today if he gets time, we have
not
forgotten.
A-Fri 30-03-2001 23:26
From the pictures, I thought you have. If that's what they look like
then just leave it. They look fine.
I'd seen some without any covering at all and didn't like it. The
Ascot kit covers are fine.
"Q"
Bike Suggestion
S-Sun 04-03-2001 1:17
I know exactly how you are feeling about this bike, been that
way a few times with various projects as well.
Personally I would love
to make one with a six speed box, speed triple pistons and camshafts.
Then have the flat slides as well, it would make a heck of a
"Q" bike,
but the overall costs then start to get out of hand. The trouble
with enthusiasm is that it is inclined to get the better of you!
So
what else can I do, but GO FOR IT!
A-Thu 08-03-2001 5:24
You wrote:
"Personally I would love to make one with a six speed box, speed
triple pistons and camshafts. Then have the flat slides as well, it
would make a heck of a "Q" bike, but the overall costs then
start to get out of hand. The trouble with enthusiasm is that it is
inclined to get the better of you."
A 6-speed box would be irrelevant in HK. Virtually nowhere to use
6th. However, a guy on the triumphclassics list wrote yesterday ....
".... the super III (Triumph) pistons and cams work excellently.
This was installed in a speed III. (I think) The
Speed III has different cams and pistons than the super III or the
classic. The Super III cams and pistons made a very noticeable
difference in performance, I think the higher compression was more of a
factor than the
cams. The same bike had the adjustable ignition advance
"kit" in it. The speed III wasn't dynoed, but with stock the
front would slightly pull off the ground during acceleration. With the
pistons, it would bring the
wheel up easily."
I'm wondering how much enthusiasm would cost if I were to ask how
much for the Speed III pistons and cams!! Can you let me know?
The
Cost of Enthusiasm
S-Thu 08-03-2001 18:58
The price of enthusiasm is as follows:
|
2 x pistons Super Three |
54.13ea 108.26 |
|
1 x piston Super Three |
55.21 |
|
Inlet cam Speed Triple |
136.08 |
|
Exhaust cam Speed Triple |
136.08 |
|
Speed Triple ECU |
314.95 |
|
Gasket set |
73.91 |
|
Labour |
200.00 |
Call it 1000.00 all done.
We recommend the Speed Triple cams as they will give better low
down power, the S3 really only had good top end only, which will
not be what you are after. We would also change the gearing since
I imagine you want a very quick 0-100 rather than be able to clock
150mph down the main street!
A-Fri 09-03-2001 7:39
Yes! Very enthusiastically!
Now this is getting interesting .... although there are one or two places here where you can
reach high speed (for 2-3 minutes).
Actually,
more than just "interesting", absolutely thrilling when you give it
a bit more thought. Here we are taking a "standard" and putting in
the pistons from this, the T3 Super III
and
the cams from this, the T3 Speed Triple
What
a set up! Here are the cam and compression figures for the technically minded:
-
The
Legend use the same cams as the other Classics - 7.1mm intake lift,
7.0mm exhaust lift, 211 degrees intake duration, 210 degrees exhaust
duration.
-
The
Speed3 used cams - 8.9mm intake lift, 8.6mm exhaust lift, 251 degrees
intake duration, 256
degrees exhaust duration.
-
The
Daytona Super 3 used cams with 9.4mm intake lift, 9.3mm exhaust lift,
262 degrees intake duration, 262 degrees exhaust duration.
The
"medium" cam is the best bet for a street machine. The Super 3
cam looks impressive, but I
think it would kill the low rpm response due
to the long duration.
The
pistons Triumph has for the Classics have a 10:1 compression ratio,
with the sportier bikes having 10.6:1 pistons. The Super 3 uses
a 12:1 piston. The
compression ratio isn't a problem for low rpm performance, so the Super
3 pistons should provide excellent performance and a substantial horsepower
boost to somewhere around 100 hp with the
"medium" cam.
(Acknowledgement:
Thanks to Jim jj_rider@worldnet.att.net
for researching the above info from the
manuals.)
S-Fri 09-03-2001 18:16
Many thanks for the confirmation of the piston/cams, we will
get them ordered up today.
I know you are excited about the bike, but we are as well and
really looking forward to seeing it done.
ECU
S-Mon 26-03-2001 18:26
We are having to do some rewiring on the ECU as the
new Legend has a different type of box to the one we want to fit.
A-Fri 30-03-2001 1:17
Don't know anything much about
ECUs. Got friends who are always
linking there laptop computers up to their bikes to experiment with
"tunes" or does that only apply to bikes with EFI?
S-Fri 30-03-2001 21:24
The ECU, electronic control unit is not, hmm not quite true, able to
be
programmed. We used to break into the boxes and replace the
"chips" with
different mappings, but it is not cost effective to do this now. The
EFI
electronic fuel injection, units vary as to the type. Triumph rely
on
downloaded programmes whereas Ducati for example use a
"chip" system.
A-Fri 30-03-2001 14:36
My posting about the Ascot and the pictures I've put up in the Yahoo!
Legend list is creating a lot of interest. One guy asked the following:
"What year Speed Triple are the piston and Cams out of?
And was there any ignition mods such as timing, and rev limit?
How about jetting?"
What should I say to him? Guess you don't mind sharing the answers.
Yahoo!
Triumph Legend Riders
S-Fri 30-03-2001 19:21
Your bike has Super Three pistons and Speed Triple Camshafts, all
from
the T3 series, there are no changes in parts for these models. We used
a
Speed Triple ECU which we rewired into the new loom. The latest
Legends
have a different box and connectors, so the replacement is not very
straight forward. The timing issue is solved by using the Speed Triple
box,
which will have the rev limit of the Speed Triple.
Goodness knows what jetting you would need for the standard carbs, it
is not something we were concerned about as the flat slides are the
important part and they will work fine. The HK crew will have to
check the jetting, since I would imagine there is a chance that it
may
possibly be a tad lean. It is really down to your local conditions.
S-Fri 30-03-2001 21:30
In the rush from yesterday I forgot to mention something about the
running of the bike. It will not run with the side stand down. The
way we have to wire the ECU into the new loom does not have the
link through the box that the latest one does. I thought it would be
OK since you have a main stand. The side stand could be looped so
that it ran but it would also mean that the bike could be put into
gear and ridden with the stand still down, not a very good idea.
A-Fri 30-03-2001 23:01
I think the T-bird is the same? Or is it only with the bike in
neutral AND the clutch held in?
Whatever, I prefer not to be able to start it up when the bike is in
gear AND the side stand is down. As you say, with the centre-stand, not
a problem.
Silencers
A-Sat 31-03-2001 8:06
Another question from the e-mail list:
"Whose exhaust is that and did it require relocating
anything?"
S-Tue 03-04-2001 22:50
They are made by X-Company, Mecatwin who supply the rest of the
lovely bits.
Question
on Power
A-Thu 29-03-2001 6:52
These are the figures given for the T509 Speed Triple.
Compression Ratio
11 : 1
Maximum power
108 PS at 9100rpm
Maximum torque
85 Nm at 7500rpm
Maximum revs
9700 rpm
How close will the Ascot come to these? Have you got the kit to
measure (not on mine of course, it's not run in yet!).
S-Fri 30-03-2001 0:38
The compression will be slightly lower as the Legend has a different
combustion chamber. The S3 pistons help this. When run in and with
the
flat slides I would like to think we were over 100 bhp rear wheel.
Sprocket
Sizes
A-Thu 29-03-2001 7:43
The link below is a really useful little calculator for no. of teeth
on sprockets. You briefly mentioned re-gearing the Ascot to suit Hong
Kong before. Have you or Joe had anymore thoughts on this - basically
would mean making it lower geared than standard, I guess.
http://www.t5net.com/common/faq/Sprockets/gearsplitter.html
S-Thu 29-03-2001 22:23
I forgot that the Legend comes with a 17t standard, so it might be
an idea to go up one on the rear to 44t. that would give you about
100mph at 7,500rpm. Getting there rather smartly too.
A-Fri 30-03-2001 1:17
Just played with most of the possibilities using that 17/44
combination and seems it will be ideal for HK with a tremendous amount
of flexibility, provided the low-end torque remains, even with the
higher compression.
S-Fri 30-03-2001 21:25
I have given Joe a 44t to put on for you. I reckon that should be OK.
Continue
.... 
